[2024-08-08]Quora问答：为什么当日本人、韩国人和越南人的文化与中国历史悠久的辉煌文明相比时，他们会感到心里不舒服？相反，欧洲人很自豪能与古希腊人和罗马人相比。这是怎么回事？

Wander Everywhere
Very simple. Because the ancient Greeks and Romans have disappeared for a very long time, whilst China is still standing up in the east so far.
Due to the disappear of ancient Greek and Rome, the barbarian kingdoms could claim they’re the heres of the Rome. This is the reason why after the death of Rome, all kinds of “Rome” appeared. France, German, Austria, British were all called themselves the Empire of Rome. Even the Russians thought they’re the legal successor of Byzantium. And even by now, some Americans also regard ancient Rome as their motherland spiritually.
The east is another story.
China, neither its territory nor its civilization nor its lineage, was really annihilated from its birth. It’s true that there may be a lot of dynasties borned, prospered and disappeared finally, but most of these dynasties are located in the centre of the China mainland and inherit the Chinese culture.

【回答】
很简单。因为古希腊和古罗马已经消失了很长时间，而中国至今仍屹立在东方。
由于古希腊和罗马的消失，蛮族王国可以宣称自己是罗马的后裔。这就是罗马灭亡后，各种“罗马”出现的原因。法国、德国、奥地利、英国都自称为罗马帝国。甚至俄国人也认为自己是拜占庭的合法继承者。甚至到了现在，一些美国人在精神上也将古罗马视为自己的祖国。
东方则是另一番景象。
中国，无论是疆域，还是文明、血脉，从诞生起就没有真正被消灭过。诚然，可能有很多朝代诞生、兴盛，最后消失，但这些朝代大多位于中国大陆的中心，继承了中华文化。

Unfortnately Korea and Vietnam were historically China’s vasals, therefore they’ll feel unconfortable on the way finding their self-identity but disappointed to find all their cultures are deeply branded China elements. More tragically, since they abandoned the Chinese characters half a century ago they couldn’t even read their ancestor’s books because all their ancient histories are written in Chinese.
Since China always exists as the dominant power in the East Asia, they couldn’t do as the European nations have done in the history that the strongest of them usually claimed they’re the successor of Rome.
I would like to exclude Japan from your list. Japan, from its very early era, is also influenced deeply by China. During the year 600 – 900AD, they sent a lot of students to Sui Dynasty and Tang Dynasty to learn from China including cultures, architectures, art, governance system, writing system etc. But Japan blended China culture with their owns and formed a very unique Japanese culture and even reversely output part of their culture to China and Korea.
So Japanese didn’t have any problems of their self-identity. They’re the master of blending different cultures. Keeping their own traditions while absorbing the other cultures.

遗憾的是，韩国和越南在历史上是中国的附属国，因此他们在寻找自我认同的道路上会感到不自在，但他们失望地发现自己的所有文化都深深打上了中国元素的烙印。更可悲的是，由于他们在半个世纪前就放弃了汉字，他们甚至无法阅读自己祖先的书籍，因为他们所有的古代历史都是用中文书写的。
由于中国一直是东亚地区的霸主，他们不可能像欧洲国家那样，在历史上最强大的国家通常都声称自己是罗马的继承者。
我想把日本排除在外。日本很早就深受中国的影响。公元 600 - 900 年间，他们向隋朝和唐朝派遣了大量留学生，学习中国的文化、建筑、艺术、管理制度和文字系统等。但日本将中国文化与自己的文化相融合，形成了非常独特的日本文化，甚至还将自己的部分文化反向输出到中国和朝鲜。
因此，日本人没有任何自我认同的问题。他们是融合不同文化的大师。既保留了自己的传统，又吸收了其他文化。

Eastern Laos Legend Lives in Vietnam (2022–present)
very simple, Similar to Europe, Are the cultures of European countries similar? I'm not talking about Catholicism, religion is just a spiritual aspect, I'm talking about the architecture, music, cuisine, costumes,... of European countries.
this question is too redundant, Vietnamese people have their own culture, their culture cannot be similar to neighboring countries,. we feel there is a huge difference with the surrounding countries,
Because in fact, Vietnam has its own culture, which cannot be confused with other Asian countries.
Although we are influenced by Confucianism, our culture is not related to other countries,
Our culture, cuisine, architecture, costumes, music, religion, do not exist in any Asian country other than Vietnam.

【回答】住在越南（2022 年 - 至今）
非常简单，类似于欧洲，欧洲国家的文化是否相似？我说的不是天主教，宗教只是精神层面，我说的是欧洲国家的建筑、音乐、美食、服饰等。
这个问题太多余了，越南人有自己的文化，他们的文化不可能与邻国相似。我们感受到与周边国家有很大的不同，
因为事实上，越南有自己的文化，不可能与其他亚洲国家混淆。
尽管我们受儒家思想的影响，但我们的文化与其他国家无关，
我们的文化、美食、建筑、服饰、音乐、宗教，除了越南之外不存在于任何亚洲国家。

Bang Na
Why do Japanese, Korean, and Vietnamese people feel uncomfortable when their culture is compared to China, a long-standing brilliant civilization?
I think this thinking is quite normal in each country. It's called nationalism. It is nationalism that helps nations continue to exist. This is not only true for Japan, Korea, and Vietnam, it is also true for all countries in the world. Countries tend not to like their culture being said to be similar to other countries.

【回答】
为什么当日本人、韩国人和越南人的文化与中国历史悠久的辉煌文明相比时，他们会感到不舒服？
我认为这种想法在每个国家都很正常。这就是所谓的民族主义。正是民族主义帮助国家继续存在。这不仅适用于日本、韩国和越南，也适用于世界上所有国家。各国往往不喜欢自己的文化被说成与其他国家相似。

On the contrary, Europeans are proud to be compared to the ancient Greeks and Romans. What happened?
I have never seen Europeans or any European country claim that Latin letters, Roman numbers, Roman culture or New Year, solar calendar, Christmas festival,... belong to them. But Chinese people always believe that all cultures of other countries are theirs. They also do not hesitate to declare that the Lunar New Year should be called Chinese New Year and from there declare that Tet belongs to China and other countries are following China's example. I don't know what other countries think, but for Vietnam, they are always proud of Vietnamese culture. Vietnamese culture belongs to Vietnamese people. It has nothing to compare with Chinese culture.

相反，欧洲人很自豪能与古希腊人和罗马人相比。这是怎么回事？
我从未见过欧洲人或任何欧洲国家声称拉丁字母、罗马数字、罗马文化或新年、阳历、圣诞节...属于他们。但中国人总是认为其他国家的所有文化都属于他们。他们还毫不犹豫地宣布农历新年应称为中国新年，并由此宣布春节属于中国，其他国家正在效仿中国。我不知道其他国家怎么想，但对越南来说，他们始终为越南文化感到自豪。越南文化属于越南人民，它与中国文化没有可比较的。

Hu Shi Xiong
China is still around .politically around too .
Depending on how you see it , Japan is still around too .
studying history is a preoccupation in east Asia for everyone to some extent . One of the most popular entertainment genre is ancient Chinese history of which three kingdoms is so common you can't even say it's emotionally owned alone by the Chinese . Rome doesn't have the same popularity as romance of the three kingdoms
I don't think the Japanese are particularly bothered by Chinese culture or history . They even have some form of ownership by twisting it into some localised version of Japanese culture . They've pretty much digested their versions of Chinese culture .
Compared to Japan , Vietnam and Korea have been twisted within a single generation in multiple directions.

【回答】
中国还在，政治上也在。
取决于你的看法，日本也还在。
在东亚，研究历史在某种程度上是每个人的兴趣所在。最受欢迎的娱乐类型之一是中国古代史，其中三国非常普遍，甚至不能说这是中国人独有的情感。罗马的受欢迎程度不及《三国演义》。
我认为日本人并不特别在意中国文化或历史。他们甚至通过将中国文化转化为某种本土化的日本文化来获得某种形式的所有权。他们几乎已经消化了自己版本的中国文化。
与日本相比，越南和韩国在短短一代人的时间内就出现了多个方向的扭曲。

Both cannot read their own history texts which were written in Chinese scrlpt ..this presents a clear break when you cannot look back and claim your history and worse it's written in Chinese scrlpt which is claimed by China . You'll see a lot of mental gymnastics when it comes to such subjects.
You don't see such mental gymnastics with Singaporean Chinese who are losing their Chinese reading abilities. We simply acknowledge we came from china at some point, some of us care about Chinese history , some don't. You'll see the same effect in hongkong and Taiwan , the same mental gymnastics to show themselves different from mainland China.

两个国家都无法阅读用中国文字书写的本国历史教科书... 当你无法回顾并主张自己的历史时，这显然是一个明显的断裂，更糟糕的是，这些历史文本是用中文书写的，而中文是中国声称拥有的。涉及到这些话题时，你会看到很多逻辑上的跳跃。
新加坡华人的中文阅读能力正在下降，但你不会看到这样的逻辑跳跃。我们只是承认自己来自中国，有些人关心中国历史，有些人则不然。你会在香港和台湾看到同样的现象，同样的逻辑跳跃来表现自己与中国大陆的不同。
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Ksawery Stojda
All the history of Europe prior to ~1500 is written in Latin (some in Greek) and only a few people can read Latin. But we still feel to be descendants of Greek-Latin culture.

【回复】1500 年以前的欧洲历史都是用拉丁文写成的（有些用希腊文），只有少数人能读懂拉丁文。但我们仍然觉得自己是希腊-拉丁文化的后裔。

Young Y
"You'll see the same effect in hongkong and Taiwan , the same mental gymnastics to show themselves different from mainland China."
To show themselves different from mainland China because they are actually more Chinese than the mainland Chinese.

【回复】“你会在香港和台湾看到同样的现象，同样的逻辑跳跃来表现自己与中国大陆的不同”
为了表现自己与中国大陆的不同，因为他们实际上比大陆中国人更像中国人。

Hu Shi Xiong
A regional culture cannot represent the entire china .
Claiming it does flies in the face of logic . It's like Quebec pretending to be french then get stumped when they visit france to see it's different.
Some weird ignorant person would from time to time despite being told that , still insist china is special and devoid of culture because “communism “

【答主回复】地区文化不能代表整个中国。
声称自己能代表整个中国是违背逻辑的。这就像魁北克人假装自己是法国人，然后在访问法国时发现情况不同而困惑不已。
有些奇怪的、无知的人尽管时不时被告知了这一情况，但仍坚持认为中国是特殊的，没有文化，因为“共产主义”。

Holy Bible
They are embarrassed because their cultures are virtually identical to Chinese culture
The first Europeans in Dong Kin they thought it was just another Chinese province.
King Muyeol of Silla begged Tang Taizong for permission to adopt Chinese culture
They are uncomfortable because they know this but do not admit it

【回复】他们感到尴尬，因为他们的文化与中国文化几乎完全相同
第一批来到东京的欧洲人认为这只是中国的另一个省份。
新罗武烈王乞求唐太宗允许他采用中国文化
他们心里不舒服，是因为他们知道这一点，但不承认
-------------------------------------------------------

CaiLei Lives in China (1975–present)
Because China declined during the late Qing Dynasty and the Republic of China. This gave the Japanese, Koreans, and Vietnamese the impression that "Western civilization is superior to Chinese civilization."
At present, the competition between China and the United States is, on the surface, a political, economic, cultural, and military competition, but in reality it is a competition between Chinese civilization and Western civilization.
This can be seen from your question: "Why do Japanese, Korean, and Vietnamese people feel uncomfortable when their culture is compared to China, a long-standing brilliant civilization?"
First of all, let’s start with “Datsu-A Ron” proposed by Japanese writer Fukuzawa Yukichi. Datsu-A Ron, thus means “the theory of getting out of Asia” or “the theory of departing from Asia.”
Why the Japanese want to "Goodbye Asia" is because they believe that Western civilization is advanced and Asian countries are backward.

【回答】住在中国（1975 年 - 至今）
由于中国在晚清时期和中华民国时期的衰落，这给日本、韩国和越南人留下了“西方文明优于中华文明”的印象。
目前，中美之间的竞争表面上是政治、经济、文化和军事的竞争，但实际上是中华文明与西方文明之间的竞争。
这一点可以从你的问题中看出：“为什么日本、韩国和越南人在他们的文化与中国这个历史悠久的辉煌文明相比较时会感到不适？”
首先，让我们从日本作家福泽谕吉提出的“脱亚论”开始。脱亚论即“脱离亚洲的理论”或“离开亚洲的理论”。
日本人想要“告别亚洲”的原因是他们认为西方文明先进，而亚洲国家落后。

* Japan produced "Datsu-A Ron" in 1885, and declared that the "wind of westernization" is blowing through the region and that countries can either accommodate it and "taste the fruit of civilization" or be left without a choice in their own destiny. The Japanese believe that Japan during the Meiji Restoration period was spiritually "out of Asia", but its two close neighbors, China and North Korea, did not seem to accept this reform, so China and South Korea lagged behind Japan. Unless there are pioneers to reform these countries, they would be conquered and divided by external forces, as shown by the unequal treaties and threat of force pushed on Asian counties by the United States and other Western powers.

* 日本在1885年发表了《脱亚论》，宣称“西化之风”正在吹遍整个地区，各国可以选择顺应它并“品尝文明的果实”，否则将无法掌控自己的命运。日本认为明治维新时期的日本在精神上已经“脱亚”，但其两个近邻，中国和朝鲜，似乎并未接受这种改革，因此中国和韩国落后于日本。除非有先驱者对这些国家进行改革，否则它们将被外部势力征服和瓜分，正如美国和其他西方列强对亚洲国家施加的不平等条约和武力威胁所表明的那样。

* South Korea suffered 35 years of colonial rule by Japan and accepted Japan's colonial ideology. After the Korean War, South Korea moved closer to the West and even followed the United States in the Vietnam War, where it committed many massacres in Vietnam. The Vietnamese are still filing prosecutions today.
* After the Sino-French War, China lost. The Qing Dynasty signed the "Sino-French New Treaty" with France, recognizing France's suzerainty over Vietnam. Vietnam was colonized by the French for 62 years. These are all seen by the Vietnamese, who believe that China is lagging behind the West. After the French retreated, the Americans stayed in Vietnam for 10 years. Although many war wounds were left behind, most Vietnamese were pro-American.

* 韩国经历了35年的日本殖民统治，并接受了日本的殖民意识形态。朝鲜战争后，韩国向西方靠拢，甚至在越南战争中追随美国，在越南犯下了许多屠杀罪行。越南人至今仍在提起诉讼。
* 中法战争后，中国战败。清朝与法国签订了《中法新约》，承认法国对越南的宗主权。越南被法国殖民了62年。这些都被越南人看在眼里，他们认为中国落后于西方。法国撤退后，美国人在越南逗留了10年。虽然留下了许多战争创伤，但大多数越南人是亲美的。

Japan, South Korea, and Vietnam were once vassal states of China, but once Japanese, Koreans, and Vietnamese felt that China was lagging behind the West, they converted to the West.
Converts to new beliefs are likely to show more devotions than those born in the beliefs, and they will undoubtedly develop a "Zeal of the convert" and take the initiative to represent the West and declare war on the ancient Chinese civilization.
Europe has not experienced the "century of humiliation" like China, so it is proud of being the successor of ancient Greece and Rome, and today's United States is undoubtedly one of the successors of the Roman Empire.

日本、韩国和越南曾是中国的附属国，但一旦日本人、韩国人和越南人觉得中国落后于西方，他们就转向了西方。转向新信仰的人往往比原本信仰的人表现出更多的虔诚，他们无疑会产生一种“皈依者狂热”，主动代表西方并向古老的中华文明宣战。
欧洲没有像中国那样经历过“百年屈辱”，因此它以作为古希腊和罗马的继承者而自豪，而今天的美国无疑是罗马帝国的继承者之一。

However, once China surpasses the West again in the future, followers of ancient Chinese dynasties such as Japan, South Korea, and Vietnam will once again look back to find the reasons for the failure of their own culture.
The grass on top of the wall sways whichever way the wind blows.
Japan, Korea, and Vietnam have never been the main body of Eastern civilization.
For 1,400 of the past 2,000 years, China has been the pinnacle of world civilization, the richest, most civilized, and most culturally prosperous country in the world, and the only one of the four major cradles of civilization that has never been interrupted.
In the past 1000 years, Chinese civilization has far surpassed Europe and Japan. Marco Polo even exclaimed that coming to China was like coming to heaven.

然而，一旦中国在未来再次超越西方，日本、韩国和越南等中国古代王朝的追随者将再次回过头来寻找自己文化失败的原因。
墙头草随风摇摆。
日本、朝鲜和越南从来都不是东方文明的主体。
在过去两千年中的一千四百年里，中国一直是世界文明的巅峰，是世界上最富裕、最文明、文化最繁荣的国家，也是四大文明摇篮中唯一从未中断过的国家。
在过去的一千年里，中华文明远远超过了欧洲和日本。马可-波罗甚至感叹，来到中国就像来到了天堂。


Andersen wrote in his fairy tale:
In the gardens of the emperor of China lived a nightingale whose song was more beautiful than the palace itself and was storied all over the world.
The Arabian folk tale "One Thousand and One Nights" contains many descrlptions of China: Aladdin is a young Chinese man who lives in a Chinese city and marries a Chinese princess.
Even in the late Qing Dynasty and the Republic of China, China temporarily lagged behind the West for 100 years, so what? Today, China can still catch up.
This is a new round of competition between Eastern and Western civilizations since the Opium War and after the Chinese people endured "Century of humiliation".

安徒生在他的童话中写道：
在中国皇帝的花园里住着一只夜莺，它的歌声比宫殿本身还要美丽，并且闻名于世。

阿拉伯民间故事《一千零一夜》中有许多关于中国的描述：阿拉丁是一个住在中国城市的中国青年，并且娶了一位中国公主。
即使在晚清和中华民国时期，中国暂时落后于西方一百年，那又怎么样？如今，中国仍然可以迎头赶上。
这是自鸦片战争以来，中国人民经历了“百年屈辱”后的新一轮东西方文明的较量。
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lisenghua
Europe dominated in the 17th and 18th centuries due to the Industrial Revolution, which rapidly spread across Europe and America, and later to Japan.
And what did they do with their "victories"? They using that to enslaved, stole, destroyed, burned, and raped others.

【回复】17世纪和18世纪，由于工业革命，欧洲在这些时期占优势，工业革命迅速传播到欧洲、美洲，后来又传到了日本。
他们用他们的“胜利”做了什么呢？他们利用这些胜利去奴役、偷窃、破坏、焚烧和强奸他人。

DAJC
That's literally what everyone did. From Romans, Persians, Arabs, Turks, Mongols to Europeans. No different.
Europe dominated since 15th century all the way up to 1950s. Not just 17th and 18th centuries.

【回复】每个人都是这么做的。从罗马人、波斯人、阿拉伯人、土耳其人、蒙古人到欧洲人。没有什么不同。
欧洲自 15 世纪起一直到 20 世纪 50 年代都占优势。不仅仅是 17 和 18 世纪。

Gondar
We justifying colonialism now by saying “everyone did it”? lol.

【回复】我们现在用“每个人都这么做”来为殖民主义辩护吗？哈哈哈

lisenghua
I want to focus on the one that still happens today, as I regard the US as still carrying their European legacy, including their Industrial Revolution advantage in WW2 and Cold war.
Don’t believe me? lets check:1. Still racist against non white —Check
2. Still do stealing, cheating, robbing against non white - Check
3. Still do imperialism - Check
Also I don't want to bother with semantic whataboutism, especially when:
* It concerns events that are not relevant today, as almost all of your examples are already gone or have undergone significant government reform
* Are not even on the same level of violence (85% of the world vs. less than one continent at most)

【回复】我想重点谈谈今天仍在发生的事情，因为我认为美国仍然延续着欧洲的遗产，包括他们在二战和冷战中的工业革命优势。
不信，我们来看看：
1.仍然存在针对非白人的种族主义 √
2.仍对非白人进行偷窃、欺骗和抢劫 √
3.仍然奉行帝国主义 √
此外，我不想纠结于那种转移话题的辩论，尤其是在以下情况下：
* 它所涉及的事件与今天无关，因为几乎所有的例子都已不复存在，或已经历了重大的政府改革
* 甚至不在同一暴力水平上（85%的世界 VS 最多不到一片大陆）

DAJC
Racist against non white? Trust me I actually wish this was true. Millions of border hoppers enter US every month if they were actually racist they would take guns and go on a killing feast. I really wish that became true but here we are borders wide open and no one is fighting back.

【回复】针对非白人的种族主义？相信我，我真希望这是真的。每个月都有数百万边境偷渡者进入美国，如果他们真的是种族主义者，他们就会拿起枪大开杀戒。我真希望这成为现实，但现在边境大开，没有人反击。

Arian Inigo
The US is not exactly racist these days. In the time of Woodrow Wilson notions of White Supremacy were sound policy platforms. In the time of Joe Biden and Donald J. Trump, not even right-wingers will touch it. In times of economic distress like these, most Americans are worried more about socioeconomic issues than about race.
One example is the rise in the number of White women marrying Black men. I personally think there are certain racial biases behind this trend (mainly more than a few White women thinking that Black men desire them unconditionally), but it wasn’t that long ago that a White woman would not be caught dead giving the time of day to a Black man.
Even if there is no longer any great stigma attached to interracial marriages, few are the Americans willing to marry across class lines these days.

【回复】如今的美国并不完全是种族主义者的天下。在伍德罗-威尔逊时代，"白人至上 "的观念是合理的政策纲领。在乔-拜登和唐纳德-J-特朗普的时代，甚至连右翼分子都不会触碰它。在这样的经济困难时期，大多数美国人更担心的是社会经济问题，而不是种族问题。
其中一个例子就是嫁给黑人男子的白人女性数量的增加。我个人认为，这一趋势的背后存在着某些种族偏见（主要是有更多的白人女性认为黑人男性无条件地渴望她们），但就在不久前，白人女性还不会对黑人男性动心。
即使跨种族通婚已不再是什么耻辱，但如今愿意跨阶级通婚的美国人却寥寥无几。

Arian Inigo
Western European kingdoms were the up-and-coming great powers in the 1500s and 1600s, becoming the most influential and powerful by the 1800s, thanks to big leaps in technology. Now that such technologies have spread all over the world in the wake of the Age of Global Empires, it’s mainly about who wins the war for the minds and hearts of the masses of humanity, if the importance of internet social media serves as any indication. (Written books and letters were the social media of earlier centuries.)

【回复】西欧王国是 16 世纪和 17 世纪崛起的大国，到了 19 世纪，由于技术的飞跃，它们成为最具影响力和最强大的国家。如今，随着全球帝国时代的到来，这些技术已经遍布全球，如果互联网社交媒体的重要性能够说明问题的话，那么这场战争的胜负主要取决于谁能赢得人类大众的思想和心灵(书籍和信件是前几个世纪的社交媒体）。

Mordechai Mandel
North and South Korea?

【回复】朝鲜和韩国？

Sumit Das
No more WEST …no more .. being an Asian i want to see The China be the Light & Hope for the World…

【回复】不再是西方了... 不再了... 作为亚洲人，我希望看到中国成为世界的光明和希望...

DAJC
“China temporarily lagged behind the West for 100 years, so what?”
Um no China also lagged behind early Roman empires. Then they lagged behind Islamic Caliphates because of Islamic golden age. Finally they lagged behind Europe and USA thanks to industrial revolution.

【回复】"中国暂时落后西方一百年，那又如何？"
不，中国也落后于早期的罗马帝国。然后，由于伊斯兰的黄金时代，他们落后于伊斯兰哈里发。最后，由于工业革命，他们落后于欧洲和美国。

Shu Liu
Because you only know the Roman empires and Islamic age. You know nothing about Chinese ancient culture and empires. Roman empires? There were Qin empires 1000 years earlier. Islamic golden age? Grateful that we didn’t involved in Islam that earlier.

【回复】因为你只知道罗马帝国和伊斯兰时代。你对中国古代文化和帝国一无所知。罗马帝国？一千年前就有秦帝国了。伊斯兰黄金时代？庆幸我们没有那么早卷入伊斯兰教。

Arian Inigo
Let’s not forget the Shang and Zhou dynasties.

【回复】我们不要忘了商周时期。

Shu Liu
There is Yu dynaties too which is before Shang, but I don’t want to argue too much with those who even don’t want to admit the existense of 5000 years Chinese history.

【回复】商朝之前还有大禹王朝，但我不想与那些甚至不愿承认中国有五千年历史的人争论太多。

DAJC
Never did I deny 5000 year old history. You ego was hurt so you decided to resort to insults rather than a proper argument.

【回复】我从未否认过五千年的历史。你的自尊心受伤了，所以你决定用侮辱而不是适当的辩论。

Shu Liu
I was not talking about you. I saw too many people give more vicious comments about Chinese history on Face book. I just don’t want to argue too much about something complicated while others don’t know or understand.

【回复】我不是在说你。我在脸书上看到太多人对中国历史发表恶毒的评论。我只是不想在别人不知道或不理解的情况下就复杂的事情争论太多。

Kevin
The Han Dynasty defeated the Xiongnu, and the remnants of the Xiongnu fled westward, reaching Europe and easily annihilating the Western Roman Empire
In the eyes of some people, the Turks were powerful, but they were the defeated soldiers of the Tang Dynasty. The Turkic kings danced for the Tang emperors in the Tang court
So where did you learn your history?

【回复】汉朝打败了匈奴，匈奴残部向西逃窜，到达欧洲，轻而易举地消灭了西罗马帝国。
在一些人眼中，突厥虽然强大，但却是唐朝的败兵。突厥国王在唐朝宫廷为唐朝皇帝跳舞。
那么，你是从哪里学习历史的？

DAJC
Western Rome fell because of internal turmoil and barbarian groups like the Visigoths, Vandals, and Ostrogoths. These invasions made the empire weak so the Huns were beating up a half dead zombie not a prime empire.

【回复】西罗马的衰落是由于内部动乱以及西哥特人、汪达尔人和奥斯托哥特人等蛮族的入侵。这些入侵使帝国变得虚弱，所以匈奴人打的是半死不活的僵尸，而不是鼎盛时期的帝国。

Arian Inigo
China was pretty wealthy even at the time of the Roman Empire. Wealthy Romans would often purchase silks and other luxury products from China through the Silk Road.

【回复】即使在罗马帝国时期，中国也相当富裕。富有的罗马人经常通过丝绸之路从中国购买丝绸和其他奢侈品。

DAJC
I'm not just taking about wealth but also military power.

【回复】我说的不仅仅是财富，还有军事实力。

Huang Kun
You said, “However, once China surpasses the West again in the future, followers of ancient Chinese dynasties such as Japan, South Korea, and Vietnam will once again look back to find the reasons for the failure of their own culture.”
Your arguments make no sense. They are proud of their own cultures. Why would they deem their cultures a failure just because the Chinese economy surpasses the West?
I think you should stop thinking China is the only culture the world has.

【回复】你说："然而，一旦未来中国再次超越西方，日本、韩国、越南等中国古代王朝的追随者将再次回过头来寻找自己文化失败的原因"。
你的论点毫无意义。他们为自己的文化而自豪。为什么他们会因为中国经济超过西方就认为自己的文化是失败的呢？
我认为你不应该再认为中国是世界上唯一的文化了。

Arian Inigo
It’s OK to be proud of one’s own country, but there is no country that can be called a true Heaven on Earth, even one with a civilization that for much of human history was the most advanced.
It’s the fault of the Qing Dynasty for allowing the Century of Humiliation to happen. They did not properly assess the threat posed by the Western Europeans and were more preoccupied with internal rebellions than foreign invasion.
And Japan would have suffered a similar fate had it not been for the Meiji Restoration; the Dutch traders that called port at Dejima in Nagasaki once yearly for almost the entire Edo Period had repeatedly told the Tokugawa Shogunate that Japan would do well to modernize along Western lines before it was too late. It’s likely that the Dutch didn’t want to lose Japan to Great Britain or France, especially after having lost their New Amsterdam Colony to the British.

【回复】为自己的国家感到自豪没问题，但没有一个国家可以被称为真正的人间天堂，即使是一个在人类历史上大部分时间里文明都是最先进的国家。
这都是清朝的错，是他们才导致了 "百年屈辱 "。他们没有正确评估西欧人带来的威胁，更多关注的是内部叛乱而非外敌入侵。
如果不是明治维新，日本也会遭受类似的命运；几乎在整个江户时代，每年都会在长崎出岛停靠一次的荷兰商人曾多次向德川幕府表示，日本最好在为时已晚之前按照西方的路线实现现代化。荷兰人很可能不想把日本拱手让给英国或法国，尤其是在把新阿姆斯特丹殖民地拱手让给英国之后。

Flyhi
One can get very specific answers from AI. However, personally, I believe that the situation reflected by this question will no longer exist in decades.

【回复】我们可以从AI中得到非常具体的答案。不过，我个人认为，几十年后，这个问题所反映的情况将不复存在。
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Hypocritic Westerner
This is just temporary because China's rejuvenation has not yet fully realised. When China finally comes back and the US influence retreats out of Asia, Chinese culture will dominate the region again.

【回答】
这只是暂时的，因为中国的复兴尚未完全实现。当中国最终回归，美国的影响力撤出亚洲时，中国文化将再次主导该地区。

Shun Bot
The best way to explain this is with a Star Wars analogy.
Pre-19th century China is like the Original Trilogy, Episodes IV to VI, the Luke Skywalker, Han Solo and Princess Leia in a bikini era.
Post-19th century China is like Disney Star Wars, pure feminist propaganda.
The people on this planet who hate Disney Star Wars the most are the fans of the Original Trilogy. This is why the Japanese, Koreans and Vietnamese hate modern China so much. They see us as the corruption of their childhoods’ favorite masterpiece.
Pre-19th century China vs. Post-19th century China. The Koreans, Japanese and Vietnamese were the biggest fans of the Original Trilogy, and are thus the biggest haters of Disney Star Wars.

【回答】
最好的解释方法就是用《星球大战》来类比。
19 世纪前的中国就像是原版三部曲中的第四集到第六集，那是卢克-天行者、汉-索罗和莱娅公主穿着比基尼的时代。
19 世纪后的中国就像迪斯尼的《星球大战》，纯粹是女权主义的宣传。
这个世界上，最痛恨迪士尼《星球大战》的人就是原版三部曲的粉丝。这就是为什么日本人、韩国人和越南人这么讨厌现代中国。在他们看来，是对他们童年最喜爱的杰作的糟蹋。
19 世纪前的中国与19世纪后的中国。韩国人、日本人和越南人是原始三部曲的忠实粉丝，因此也是迪士尼《星球大战》的最大仇恨者。


Each country has dealt with this trauma differently.
* Japan deals with it by treating Chinese worse than subhumans and conducts biological warfare experiments on civilians.
* Korea deals with it by writing their own Star Wars fanfiction and pretending like the Original Trilogy was actually Korean.
* Vietnam deals with it by being poor and burning down Chinese factories in their country.
We all have different ways to process trauma.
As for the Roman Empire, the same thing happened. It peaked with Augustus, Trajan and Constantine, but ended up with the embarrasing shitshow that was the Byzantines, the Disney Star Wars of the Roman legacy.
But fortunately for the Roman brand name, Western European scholars rebranded the Eastern Roman Empire into the “Byzantine Empire”. This move protected the Roman Empire brand name from the ill-repute of the Byzantine Empire. Even though the two were the same empire.

每个国家都以不同的方式处理这一心理创伤。
* 日本的做法是把中国人当作次等人对待，并对平民进行生物战实验。
* 韩国的应对方法是编写自己的《星球大战》同人小说，并假装《星球大战》原版三部曲实际上是韩国的。
* 越南通过贫穷和烧毁国内的中国工厂来处理创伤。
我们每个国家处理心理创伤的方式各不相同。
罗马帝国也是如此。它在奥古斯都、特拉扬和君士坦丁时期达到顶峰，但最终却以拜占庭这个令人难堪的烂摊子而告终，堪比罗马遗产中的迪士尼版《星球大战》。
但幸运的是，西欧学者将东罗马帝国改称为 "拜占庭帝国"，从而保护了罗马帝国的名声。此举保护了罗马帝国的品牌，使其免受拜占庭帝国的恶名。尽管两者是同一个帝国。

You would be shocked at how many people don’t know that the Byzantine Empire is the Roman Empire, and it was never actually called the “Byzantine” Empire by anyone when it was still alive. Back then, everyone called it the Roman Empire… because that’s what it was.
This would be like if Disney decided to cut its losses and just retcon the crappy Star Wars movies it made under a different name, like “Rey and Friends” or something.
The decision of Western historians to rebrand the Eastern Roman Empire as the “Byzantine Empire” has saved the brand image of the “Roman Empire”. Had they not done this, the modern prestige of the Roman Empire would not be what it is.
By this same logic. The Japanese tried to rebrand China as “Shina” in the 19th and 20th centuries. In Japan today, a disgustingly high portion of the population insist on calling China “Shina” rather than Chugoku, the actual name. They do this because they want to reserve “Chugoku” for the cool, pre-19th century China that all their culture is based on, and give “Shina” to the post-19th century China that they absolutely despise.

有多少人不知道拜占庭帝国就是罗马帝国，这一点会让你大吃一惊，而且在拜占庭帝国还在世的时候，从来没有人真正称它为 "拜占庭 "帝国。那时，每个人都称它为罗马帝国... 因为它就是罗马帝国。
这就好比迪斯尼决定减少损失，用另一个名字，比如 "雷伊和朋友们 "什么的，来重构它拍的那些蹩脚的《星球大战》电影。
西方历史学家决定将东罗马帝国重新命名为 "拜占庭帝国"，挽救了 "罗马帝国 "的品牌形象。如果他们没有这样做，罗马帝国的现代声望就不会是现在这样。
按照同样的逻辑。19 世纪和 20 世纪，日本人曾试图将中国重新命名为 "zhina"。在今天的日本，有相当一部分人坚持把中国称为 "zhina"，而不是 "中国"（Chugoku）。他们之所以这样做，是因为他们想把 "中国" 这一名字留给很酷的、19 世纪前的中国，他们所有的文化都是建立在这个基础之上的，而把 "zhina" 留给他们绝对鄙视的 19 世纪后的中国。
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Robert Daniels
But for a bunch of Catholic idiots in 1204 the Byzantines might have survived ot the present day as effectively a nation of western Turkey and all of Greece.

【回复】要不是1204年那群愚蠢的天主教徒，拜占庭人或许能存续到今天，成为一个包括土耳其西部和整个希腊的国家。

Bora Tas
Constantinople was a mess when the Turks conquered it in 1453 indeed. The Eastern Roman Empire never recovered from the 4th crusade.

【回复】君士坦丁堡在1453年被土耳其人征服时确实是一团糟。东罗马帝国从第四次十字军东征后就一蹶不振了。

Shun Bot
The Byzantine Empire was dysfunctional at its very core.
The only reason why it survived so long is because it existed at a time when its neighbors were so primitive that they couldn’t even collect taxes properly, never mind fielding a professional army.
As soon as the Turks arrived on the scene, the writing was on the wall, and the fall of the empire was just a matter of time.
The Crusaders just hastened the inevitable.

【答主回复】拜占庭帝国的核心功能失调。
它之所以能存活这么久，唯一的原因是它存在的时代其邻国非常原始，甚至无法正常收税，更不用说组建职业军队了。
一旦土耳其人登上历史舞台，灭亡的命运已成定局，帝国的覆灭只是时间问题。
十字军只是加速了不可避免的结局。

Tej Singh Tomer
Lol, even the Ottomans considered themselves to be successors of the Romans.

【回复】哈哈，就连奥斯曼人也认为自己是罗马人的继承者。

Shun Bot
They literally called themselves the Roman Empire

【答主回复】他们确实自称为罗马帝国

David Nordlund
Nice analogy. To expand on it, the Roman/Byzantine franchise finally ended so all the fanboys can pick and choose what they liked about it without worrying about the next movie coming out.

【回复】这个比喻不错。进一步展开来说，《罗马/拜占庭》系列最终完结了，因此，所有的粉丝们可以挑选他们自己喜欢的部分，而不用担心下一部电影的上映。
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PU TAN PhD in Physics, Autonomous University of Barcelona
Because the ancient Greeks and Romans no longer exist. It will make people proud that if they have a strong and glory ancestor.
But China is still there and grows rich and powerful. It’s like your brother was much poorer than you in the past decades. But now he makes a very successful investment earns lots of money, even richer than you. This metamorphosis in recent year will shock them and make them envious.

【回答】巴塞罗那自治大学 物理学博士
因为古希腊人和古罗马人已不复存在。如果有一个强大而荣耀的祖先，会让人们感到自豪。
但中国依然存在，而且日益富强。这就好比你哥哥在过去几十年里比你穷得多。但现在他的投资非常成功，赚了很多钱，甚至比你还富有。这种近一年来的蜕变会让他们感到震惊和嫉妒。

Evan Dyck Knows Dutch
The ancient Greeks and Romans no longer exist
Meanwhile China is a gigantic country with a huge army and nukes
Do the math

【回答】懂荷兰语
古希腊和古罗马已经消失了。
与此同时，中国是一个拥有庞大军队和核武器的大国。
自己算算。

Yeeeeeee Fri
Because for a long time, these three countries used to be largely dependent on China, with a very high degree of autonomy, but needing China to recognize their legitimate rights.
They certainly had their own unique cultures, but they were inevitably influenced by Chinese culture.
For example, Japan learned a great deal about Tang culture, such as architectural styles, the tea ceremony, and writing, and refined its existing culture based on this. As a matter of fact, since it did not have a direct border with China, the interference of ancient China in Japan was very small, but it is undeniable that the influence of Chinese culture on Japan existed and was considerable.
As for Korea, its origins, "高句麗", were destroyed by the Tang dynasty in 668. After that, it alternately succumbed to the changing Chinese dynasties. During this period, it was called "高麗". Its next name, "朝鮮", was decided by Zhu Yuanzhang, the first emperor of the Ming Dynasty, and was officially recognized by the second emperor of the Ming Dynasty in 1401 in order to gain legal rights.
In my opinion, Vietnam is a country less influenced by China. Probably because I haven't done much research on the relationship between the two. I hope someone can add to it.
And you can check some ancient Korean or Japanese documents and you will find that most of the official documents are written in Chinese. This is also important evidence of the influence of Chinese culture
Even the earliest official history of Japan, "Nihon shoki(にほんしょき)", was written in Chinese. To this day, many kanji still exist and are used in Japanese.

【回答】
因为很长一段时间，这三个国家在很大程度上依赖中国，享有很高的自治权，但需要中国承认它们的合法权利。
它们当然有自己的独特文化，但不可避免地受到了中国文化的影响。
例如，日本从唐朝文化中学到了很多东西，如建筑风格、茶道和书法，并在此基础上改进了其现有文化。事实上，由于日本与中国没有直接边界，古代中国对日本的干涉很小，但不可否认，中国文化对日本的影响存在且相当大。
至于韩国，其起源“高句丽”在668年被唐朝摧毁。之后，它在不断变化的中国朝代中轮流屈服。在此期间，它被称为“高丽”。其下一个名字“朝鲜”是由明朝的第一位皇帝朱元璋命名的，并在1401年由明朝的第二位皇帝正式承认以获得合法权利。
在我看来，越南是一个受中国影响较小的国家。可能是因为我对两者之间的关系研究不多。希望有人能补充一下。
你还可以查阅一些韩国或日本的古代文献，你会发现大多数官方文件都是用中文书写的。这也是中国文化影响的重要证据。甚至日本最早的官方历史书《日本书纪》也是用中文写成的。直到今天，日语中仍然存在并使用许多汉字。

I believe that today, Korea, Japan and Vietnam feel uncomfortable when others compare their civilizations to China because of their historical lack of cultural independence.
Because China is the nominal sovereign state of these three countries, the influence of Chinese civilization on their cultures is inevitable and far-reaching. Comparing their civilization with the Chinese civilization may make them subconsciously feel that you are implying that they once belonged to the circle of influence of Chinese culture and were influenced by China, or even implying that they once had a history of being a Chinese vassal state. This is unacceptable to independent nation-states nowa

我相信，今天的韩国、日本和越南在别人将他们的文明与中国进行比较时，之所以会感到不舒服，是因为他们在历史上缺乏文化独立性。由于中国是这三个国家名义上的宗主国，中华文明对其文化的影响是不可避免且深远的。将他们的文明与中华文明进行比较，可能会让他们下意识地觉得你在暗示他们曾经属于中华文化的影响圈，受到了中国的影响，甚至暗示他们曾经有过作为中国藩属国的历史。这对于现在的独立国家来说是难以接受的。
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Hu Shi Xiong
This is unacceptable to independent nation-states nowa
This has some cognitive dissonance associated with it when you have to bow to another more powerful country and host their bases then pretend you're independent

【回复】“这对于现在的独立国家来说是难以接受的”
当你不得不向另一个更强大的国家低头，接纳他们的基地，然后假装自己是独立国家的时候，这种认知失调就产生了

Travis Trans
It’s Vietnam that resembles China the most, culturally. But we don’t want to acknowledge that fact.

【回复】在文化上最像中国的是越南。但我们不愿承认这一事实。
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Paul Denlinger Lived in Japan
Because the Roman Empire no longer exists. It’s easy to be proud of a dead ancestor.
China is right next door, bigger, richer and more powerful than it has been for a long time.

【回答】在日本生活
因为罗马帝国已经不复存在了。为死去的祖先感到自豪很容易。
而中国就在隔壁，比以往任何时候都更大、更富、更强。